To lease or not to lease?

in #hive-1679222 months ago

         It's been a long time since I visited the Hive Engine frontend at https://hive-engine.com. One of the reasons for my revisit was the RC leasing feature at https://hive-engine.com/lease. For the most part, I use Tribaldex to manage my tokens.

         In essence, it's like @dlease, but with more tokens in the mix. As you can see, leasing your "asset" is not a novel concept. Even @blocktrades sells delegations as part of the services offered. Today, you can still delegate to reputable curation groups for returns. I'm sure many folks remember the debacles that came with bid bots. That was a darker time.

         There are a few delegation requests on the page. I suspect it has more to do with the ROI. When I look at my curation stats on HiveStats.io, I get over 9% from curation alone. I don't even utilize my voting power efficiently because I have days when I sit at 100%. So, hitting 10% on curation is more than likely. Although, if you were going to be passive about your HP, having an ROI is better than none.

         I know delegation for profit is controversial for some. I have no qualms about how people handle their own assets. It's not like private deals wouldn't happen if we opted for a more draconian stance against people leasing.

          As I wrote earlier, there are other tokens you could offer as payment. It doesn't seem like people are utilizing them at the moment. I wouldn't mind filling some requests for SPS or DEC. So far, I can't tell if it's due to a lack of awareness or desire. Then again, most people who keep things on the chain usually want their assets in HIVE.

RC delegation was supposed to be the next big thing?

         There doesn't seem to be a desire to pay for RC right now. Or, the filled requests aren't displayed on the page? The bear market certainly does not help with the demand. I can't assess how it would have played out had the RC delegation come out in 2021. Since it's so new, I don't think people have figured out how much they are worth.

         For me, RC is free for the most part, as it derives from my own HP. So, if I were to get any returns, it would be worthwhile. Would I use this service? Probably not extensively. I will definitely check every now and again to see if I want to fulfill someone's request.

         Maybe the issue is the timing in the market cycle. We shall see.

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good stuff

It's Pretty Awesome i would say.

Never tried leasing in crypto before and well Good to know something more about it.

!PIZZA

I don't dabble much in it, but I might for RC.

Nice. I will also probably do same with RC. Have more than enough.

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Those percentages on the RC delegation are horrible. You might was well be dealing with real world savings accounts at that point. .11%! Horrible!

Haha, it's weaker than banks.

Honestly I'll probably save my RC for those I feel are worthy to sponsor, who need it to get started. At least until my account gets big enough to do both :) ...

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Yeah, that's fair.

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9.11% is a good percentage for those who have little time for curation.

Indeed.

Renting RC is like buying a disposable battery. Buying HP is like buying a battery that charges itself plus you still keep your money. Who in their right mind... nevermind. I don't want to talk about this.

I guess it's a way for skeptics to try out different aspects of the chain before diving in.

That's a lot of hoops to go through just to test something. It's also a ripoff and a fancy way to create more skeptics. And wouldn't one need to purchase HIVE to begin the test. A few steps could be skipped there.

This concept stems from the mindset long ago where stakeholders profiteering by selling votes thought they could also dip into something else, increase their stacks; but diminish the incentive to purchase HP which increases the value of their stacks. So typical...

You said the quiet part out loud!

Oh shit. Not again!

There is really no reason to buy RC, most users have more than enough, the only ones that don't are new users and spammers. New users can be supported by the dApps that onboarded them (via RC Delegations). That I believe is the main selling point of RC Delegations. There may be some unique edge cases for RC delegation outside of dApps (like 3000 Jaw Theme Song comments on every comment or some shit).

What comes to mind though is the scenario involving an account (dApp) attempting to provide RC for all, becoming successful, then not able to meet requirements. Effectively screwing themselves and causing consumers to panic or being asked to provide their own RC. In business maybe you can handle the first 10k but the next 10k expects to be treated the same as the first 10k. If something shocks the system, then they're all pissed. That's a worse case scenario that needs to be avoided. I'd still encourage accounts to provide their own RC ASAP by powering up at least bare minimum, taking the load off the products they enjoy so it can continue to run smoothly.

On a large scale, RC is easy. Most accounts use less than 1% of their RC. Most dApps should be able to easily support thousands of users with modest HP. The real problem comes when dApps don't have any real HP and they want to support a lot of users without being established. This problem can be solved though as someone can help support them although it is harder as you can't delegate RC to them and by proxy support their users as they can't distribute that RC. This is where pools were more valuable.

Right. There is a huge surplus nationwide, in a sense. And development leading to successful products can't just be for the wealthy; those able to afford enough HP to cover all RC cost. Success needs to be attainable even for someone wanting to start at the bottom from scratch. Healthy competition.

At the same time, I'm not a fan of the handout. I think there's a very delicate balancing act. I'm looking at the future rather than now, factoring in potential price surges that stick. And I hear you as well. Success for all is a group effort. If the product is worth supporting, one isn't shooting themselves in the foot by helping it out.

Just running scenarios through my mind with several dApps and several hundred thousand users, even millions. Can get to a point where things are thriving but suddenly several require bailouts, then you have to start picking and choosing. I prefer self-sustaining practices straight out of the gates every time I look. Then the surplus is there, safety measure; peace of mind. No credit crunch, in a sense.

Pardon my edits. LOL and yeah total disaster in the making handing that shit to just anyone but hey, let's learn the hard way.

I'm not understanding the whole RC thing and wouldn't you rather just buy and power hive to earn the RC yourself anyways? Also seems like maybe that was invented during a time when things where getting crazy on hive over a year ago. For not there's not a huge amount of onboarding where RC is really needed.

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The only other useful thing I can think of is allowing services such as @hiveonboard to actually have the account tokens.

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I was wondering what it took to get folks to wholesale out their votes, now I know, pay 1.5% and the pool is your's to reap.
Mammon must be proud.

9% is the linear reward.
To get more you need large votes on days 2-7.
IF you are not gonna vote your hp, you do much better to store stake in hbd at 20%.
Absent a moonshot.

Concentrating stake in the hands of those that already have too much is not good for the coin, imo.

We’ll see how many is into this.

I don't think there is a demand for that RC delegation and can they even delegate out the RCs that you delegate? It's a little bit weird but there isn't the demand for RCs yet. Other than account creation tokens, I don't see too much use for them outside of the bots requiring a ton of RCs.

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Maybe one day.

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There doesn't seem to be a desire to pay for RC right now.

There is little financial incentive to have more RC (outside of being able to create more account tokens). Most users have "more than enough" RC to conduct their business. I see RC delegation mostly for dApps so they can support their user base allowing them to transact, especially new users.

Yeah, that makes sense.

Great read. I'm still figuring this returns thing out. I want to delegate unused tokens like oneup, bpc and the like but not sure how to go about doing it.

You'll have to find people or services that will take them in exchange for stuff.


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